Hoover VT814D21-80 Motor Problem - But Motor Tests OK...?

[steverob10]

My Hoover washer is displaying E08 error code, indicating a motor problem, so I took out the motor and had a good look and then checked it with a multimeter. The results are puzzling me:

• First step: carbon brushes have around 4 cm left on them - plenty - they're only a year or so old.
• I cleaned the commutator thinking it might be that - then put it all back

The machine still didn't work: on the spin cycle, after the pump stops, there's the characteristic graunchywhine for a second and then nothing. So I know power is getting to the motor. I tried to help it on its way by moving the drum at the same time the motor was energised and it did start to spin for a while but then stopped again and wouldn't go. So I took the motor off and starting probing it with a multimeter:

• Tacho contacts: 40 ohm
• Stator windings - all around 2-4 ohms (3 circuits) - so they're OK
• Armature - very slowly rotating the spindle through 360 deg, I measured the resistance, which varied from 2 to 4 ohm. No open or short circuit I could see.

So, given the cost of a motor, should I just buy another one anyway (even though I can't detect the issue), or is there something else I should check first?

Thanks :)

 

[Whitegoodshelp (Andy)]

You can’t replace the motor because it could be a power issue from the PCB. You can’t replace the PCB because it could be the motor. The problem with a fault like this is that until you’ve tried a new motor you can’t know if it is the motor at fault or something else. 
 

An engineer could just fit a new motor and if it fixes the fault great, but if not they can put the old one back, and try something else. 
 

[andyr12345]

41 minutes ago, steverob10 said:

My Hoover washer is displaying E08 error code, indicating a motor problem, so I took out the motor and had a good look and then checked it with a multimeter. The results are puzzling me:

• First step: carbon brushes have around 4 cm left on them - plenty - they're only a year or so old.
• I cleaned the commutator thinking it might be that - then put it all back

The machine still didn't work: on the spin cycle, after the pump stops, there's the characteristic graunchywhine for a second and then nothing. So I know power is getting to the motor. I tried to help it on its way by moving the drum at the same time the motor was energised and it did start to spin for a while but then stopped again and wouldn't go. So I took the motor off and starting probing it with a multimeter:

• Tacho contacts: 40 ohm
• Stator windings - all around 2-4 ohms (3 circuits) - so they're OK
• Armature - very slowly rotating the spindle through 360 deg, I measured the resistance, which varied from 2 to 4 ohm. No open or short circuit I could see.

So, given the cost of a motor, should I just buy another one anyway (even though I can't detect the issue), or is there something else I should check first?

Thanks

 

in the old days that would more than likely be a great big shiny chrome capacitor that kick started the motor - the fact its doing something to try and revolve when you give the drum a helping hand and pushing it by hand and a graunch whine sounds to me like it could be same kid of thing a motor capacitor. - 

These days the capacitor(s) will be on a main board or motor control board, I think they will still be huge capacitors  you could look and see if any electrolyte has leaked out of them or have burnt out or wrong OHM's measurements be careful though those big capacitors sure do hold some voltage in them even when the machine's 3 pin plug is plugged out of the wall I have got a jolt a couple of times before off them boards - you need to 'de-energise' the capacitors  first before touching the boards really to be safe 


 

[Whitegoodshelp (Andy)]

Aye it could be a power supply problem to the motor (PCB) but the exact same symptoms can be caused by a faulty armature in the motor. 

[steverob10]

Thanks for this - I have had the control board out: it doesn't have any big caps, and no sign of any tracks blackened, so I'm going with the faulty armature theory for now. (Just thinking: don't know how many poles there are in a motor like this, but I guess that if there was a short between the windings of two adjacent poles, you wouldn't necessarily see much with an ohmeter but it might make a difference to the efficiency of the motor which would be most noticeable as it tries to move the drum from stationary. Once the drum is revolving it has momentum so I guess the load on the motor is lower which might explain why it could keep going once I pushed it as it started but couldn't get it moving once it had stopped.) But I'll see if there is a separate capacitor somewhere.

[Whitegoodshelp (Andy)]

Yes Steve that’s the problem, that particular fault in a motor doesn’t show up with a continuity meter. And you can’t detect a fault with the power supply to the motor unless you can test all the resisters, diodes and capacitors and know all the expected values. 

[andyr12345]

Andy - would the motor be 230v AC 50hz single phase? , could a patch cable go directly to the motor to test the motor directly or has it got to go through a controller board?

•  

[andyr12345]

@steverob10 - error E08 though is actual 'speed Sensor' (the tacho coil at the rear of the motor) rather than the actual motor itself isnt it .  

So, if the coil at the rear of the motor is working ok and not open circuit , then it wouldgo to the controller board and then through chips / microprocessor and other components I should imagine? 

Is this YT video any help?

https://youtu.be/D5Aw7CBEGPI?t=100

 

[Whitegoodshelp (Andy)]

On 15/03/2022 at 20:39, andyr12345 said:

Andy - would the motor be 230v AC 50hz single phase? , could a patch cable go directly to the motor to test the motor directly or has it got to go through a controller board?

•  

Usually if you know how to do it supplying the motor directly will cause it to go into a full spin. It’s a bit dicey though. 

[steverob10]

Thanks again - I've seen the video which was helpful. I guess I could try powering up the motor - there's another video on YT that shows how to do this, but I didn't fancy doing that without clamping everything down and I don't really have anywhere to do that. The easiest thing is to try it with a new motor which is on order.

[Whitegoodshelp (Andy)]

Good luck. It’s a big gamble. Let us know how you get on. 

[andyr12345]

4 hours ago, steverob10 said:

Thanks again - I've seen the video which was helpful. I guess I could try powering up the motor - there's another video on YT that shows how to do this, but I didn't fancy doing that without clamping everything down and I don't really have anywhere to do that. The easiest thing is to try it with a new motor which is on order.

You could have left the motor in situ actually on the washing machine tub itself, just make up a lead with a 3 pin plug on one end then just live, neutral to the right terminals on the motor and earth to the casing of the motor. But that will be the next best thing ordering a new motor I suppose - good luck and i hope it works for you.