What is this pipe going to the top of the tub?

[andyr12345]

Hi Andy - not a repair question just a curious one but what does this pipe do / what is it for / how does it work on the Samsung washing machine can you tell me please? 

It goes from the Soap drawer housing and across to the top of the drum plastic outer tub -  I have not seen it on Hotpoint washing machines. And its not the big diameter normal hose that sends downs the water and detergent , that is at the back of the Soap dispenser drawer as normal to the tub . 

also, you don't hear too much these days of the 'Jet Rinse System' (was that a Zanussi design back in the day) did it not take off or wasn't effective?

here is a pic of the hose:

[Whitegoodshelp (Andy)]

Hi Andy. At first I thought it looks like a way of venting steam. Old Hoover washing machines used have a special hose that was just designed to vent steam out. They later ditched it in favour of incorporating the steam vent in the soap dispenser.

But if this hose is connected to the water valve then it must send water in through the top of the tub. The main reason to send water in through the top of the tub would be to recycle the water inside the drum which is what many washing machines have done in the past. This of course allows them to wash in much lower levels of water. Instead of having to put enough water in to submerge the laundry they can have considerably less water but continuously sprinkled the laundry with water from the top of the drum.

The problem with this setup is that it would end up adding extra water not recycling it. So it's probably not that. The only other reason to introduce extra water is to condense the steam on a washer dryer. But again this hose seems to just lead to the top of the drum and not to a condenser chamber.

It is difficult to be a hundred percent sure from the photo, but is that holes in the top of the tub connected to the soap dispenser or to the water pipe that runs along the side? I've assumed the latter but maybe it's just a slight optical illusion? If it is just attached to the soap dispenser than I would have to go with my first thought. Also where does the long holes along the side that appears to be connected to the water valve go to at the other end?

 

[andyr12345]

Thanks Andy. So this hose from the top of the drum is not connected to a water valve at all - its just connected to the side of the soap dispenser housing - in fact if I remove the whole dispenser drawer (by pushing down on the blue lever and pulling the whole soap drawer out of its housing) I can see the hole at the side of the housing where that pipe from top of the drum attaches to it  - so maybe you are right, maybe it just vents the heat / steam out of the drum and into the soap drawer housing and then presumably back into the drum again or out of the handle of the soap drawer . 

That other pipe (that goes along the side of the soap drawer housing) does go to a water valve it looks but then ends up going to the top of the door gasket! - for what reason I am not sure??? - maybe its for the machines with 'Add Wash' door feature but that whole pipe is missing on my model . 



(here is where I am getting the pics from BTW from: https://objects.icecat.biz/objects/mmo_87050793_1630397705_64_10689.pdf )

 

[Whitegoodshelp (Andy)]

Hi Andy. So it looks like my initial instinct may be correct. It's probably a way for the steam generated, especially on a very hot wash, to vent into the soap dispenser. Soap dispensers used to have a vent to the outside.

So the other long hose is there to flush water directly into the drum? They could use that to put the initial bit of water into the washing machine that is designed to run into the sump hose. A small ball in the sump hose then floats up and seals it off. As you probably know this is in order to stop wastage of detergent that could otherwise running so the sump hose and stay there during the wash.

They can't use the same water that flushes the detergent into the drum because obviously it will flush detergent into the sump hose. This

[andyr12345]

35 minutes ago, Whitegoodshelp (Andy) said:

Hi Andy. So it looks like my initial instinct may be correct. It's probably a way for the steam generated, especially on a very hot wash, to vent into the soap dispenser. Soap dispensers used to have a vent to the outside.

So the other long hose is there to flush water directly into the drum? They could use that to put the initial bit of water into the washing machine that is designed to run into the sump hose. A small ball in the sump hose then floats up and seals it off. As you probably know this is in order to stop wastage of detergent that could otherwise running so the sump hose and stay there during the wash.

They can't use the same water that flushes the detergent into the drum because obviously it will flush detergent into the sump hose. This

Ah right thanks for the reply. Its funny really why they would have a small little pipe like that to vent the drum when the soap dispenser already has a much larger pipe where the detergent and water goes down anyway from the soap dispenser drawer housing to the outer plastic tub, you would think that was more than sufficient enough top let steam and hot air exit the tub without that little hose?

strange enough the sump on our Samsung washer has not got the ol' ping pong ball in the sump on there at all . I tipped back the machine and got underneath and squeezed the sump hose and there is definitely no ball in there , is in our previous Hotpoint. - here is a question is the drain pump noisier in a machine with a ball in the sump hose or is there no difference?

So the way it feels the Samsung starts is it weighs the drum with clothes in (dry) then starts to fill up the machine then you can hear the pump of the auto-dispenser kicking in.  and on ours the pipe that runs along the soap drawer housing to the door gasket is not there at all either on ours , maybe it is there for the more expensive models?

Is the other function of the ping pong ball float to stop water syphoning back into the washer drum too? - so, say if where the washer drain pipe goes into (say under the sink) if the sink has problems and the dirty water goes from the sink down the washer drain hose it will then float up the white ping pong ball and block the hole to the drum tub so the dirty water cannot enter the tub? - is that another feature of it?




 

[Whitegoodshelp (Andy)]

Hi Andy. Yes it could be due to the angle of the soap dispenser hose. It usually goes into the outer drum a little way down from the top and to the side. The pressure of steam is likely to send it right up to the top and be pressing against the top of the tub. So maybe that's why? But having said that, Hoover washing machines used to use the soap dispenser to vent steam for decades. But they did have a hose that went from the back of the soap dispenser to a plastic vent in the back of the frame so that steam would be able to literally leave the washing machine.

I can't think of any other sensible possible use for a hose in the top of the tub entering the soap dispenser.

Regarding the plastic ball in the sump it may be possible that manufacturers have started to not use it anymore. They did used to cause a lot of problems, certainly in the Hoover washing machines. They used to get coated in sticky gunge and then stick. This completely sealed off the sump hose and pump and stop the washing machine fermenting water.

Regarding noise, the ball should be silent against the rubber and is held inside the sump hose so I can see contributing any noise at all. Washing machine pumps have been ridiculously noisy for decades. This is ever since they changed over to the cheap vortex pumps. Again going back to Hoover, where I have the longest and the oldest experience, there pumps in the 70s were small induction motors that were very quiet indeed. They consisted of approximately 11 parts, all well made, but all easily replaced. Used to repair pumps all of the time. Of course once they disappeared in favour of the much cheaper vortex pumps the noise increased and they are totally repairable.

Regarding weighing the laundry I presume the only way to do that is by processing the resistance placed on the motor when turning the drum.

The ball in the sump hose is purely there to seal off the water in the drum from the sump hose. I doubt that anybody ever thought about water siphoning back into the washing machine. But as is often the case, you have thought of something interesting. It had never crossed my mind but I think yes that would be an unexpected benefit.

[andyr12345]

Thanks for the reply Andy, that is interesting about the Pump. When i used to repair my own Hotpoint washing machines years ago they had these larger drain pumps with big white plastic fans on them and the propellers inside were decent and a lot quieter than these new ones , they used to move more freely as well these newer ones without fans seem to 'jerk' as you move them with your finger. The drain pumps on the older ones used to run continuously as well throughout the duration of the drain and drain and spin - the ones on the newer washers now keep stopping and starting throughout the drain or spin and then are very noisy when the water gets low in the pump itself , not too predictable really as well I find . There will be times where it does do a good job of detecting there is no water in the pump and will switch off near immediately (I wonder what switch or sensor knows that its pumping dry?) and then there will be other times where it takes ages just noisily pumping away when it doesn't even need to be doing. 
 

[Whitegoodshelp (Andy)]

1 hour ago, andyr12345 said:

(I wonder what switch or sensor knows that its pumping dry?

I just presumed it was when the pressure switch turned off when the water was drained out. Maybe they are set to continue pumping for 30 seconds or so after just to make sure?