Washing Machine Fill Times

[john.G]

I have two Zanussi washing machines, one a 2006 model ZWF1221G, the other, a 2013 model ZWG6141P.                                                                                                                         Both wiill operate from either a CWST in the attic or mains.

The 2006 model operates exactly as expected, a fill volume (empty) of ~ 16 Litres  with a fill time of 259 secs on CWST fill and 114 secs on mains filling. However the 2013 model gives exactly the same fill time of ~ 125 secs on both CWST fill and mains fill with obviously a big difference in fill levels, I can't just now access the standpipe hose but on CWST fill the level is well below the door lip and I measured the level at ~ 6/8 ins above the bottom of the drum, when I pump it out and fill manually to the same level it takes ~ 8 litres, it is too far above the door level to measure it manually on mains fill but is obviouly far greater. It would appear that this model just gives a timed filling period of 120/125 secs irrespective of CWST fill or mains fill, is this normal for this model?.

Both machines, if started with both filling valves shut will time out with a flashing run light after 5/6 minutes and I think the solenoid valves shut.

 

 

[Whitegoodshelp (Andy)]

The newer the washing machine the less water should be used. Modern ones hardly use any. No washing machine should fill for a set time regardless as it would result in wildly differing water levels. They all control water levels with air pressure. The following articles may be interesting -

 

• how does a washing-machine control water levels?
• is my washing machine taking in enough water?
• how low water pressure affects washing machines  

[john.G]

Measured pumped out volumes, 5.9 litres after CWST fill and 14.4 litres after mains fill, both fill times 126 secs.

[john.G]

Hi Andy,

Removed the Level switch which is a 545-AA-006 (0-300mm H2O)

The three pins are marked 1. 5V   2. 6MD   3.out

With pins removed and mains power on , I get 1. 0V 2. -5V and 3.  -5V  (note the minus readings)

With pins (jack) reinserted I get 1. 0V 2. -5V & 3. -2.6V. (the readings are exactly the same whether empty or after a prewash fill or after main fill.

The hose is clear when i blow down it.

The switch itself seems to be spring loaded towards a vacuum condition, ie when I suck it I can feel it moving downwards but when I blow there seems to no movement upwards.

 

 

 

[Whitegoodshelp (Andy)]

Hi. If you pour a kettle full of cold water into the drawer whilst it is filling is everything OK? 

[john.G]

On 28/03/2021 at 16:37, Whitegoodshelp (Andy) said:

Hi. If you pour a kettle full of cold water into the drawer whilst it is filling is everything OK? 

Yes, if I even poured ~ 5 litres into the drawer it will still continue for this fixed time even though above the normal level.                                                                                                                                                                              (Thought I'd posted this previously).  I installed a slightly different analogue sensor which I picked up for a few euros, its a 545-AA-017 (0-380mm H2O) and I get exactly the same fill times/volumes as with the 545-AA-006 (0-300mm H2O).

Edited April 4, 2021 by john.G

[john.G]

On 23/03/2021 at 12:33, john.G said:

I have two Zanussi washing machines, one a 2006 model ZWF1221G, the other, a 2013 model ZWG6141P.                                                                                                                         Both wiill operate from either a CWST in the attic or mains.

The 2006 model operates exactly as expected, a fill volume (empty) of ~ 16 Litres  with a fill time of 259 secs on CWST fill and 114 secs on mains filling. However the 2013 model gives exactly the same fill time of ~ 125 secs on both CWST fill and mains fill with obviously a big difference in fill levels, I can't just now access the standpipe hose but on CWST fill the level is well below the door lip and I measured the level at ~ 6/8 ins above the bottom of the drum, when I pump it out and fill manually to the same level it takes ~ 8 litres, it is too far above the door level to measure it manually on mains fill but is obviouly far greater. It would appear that this model just gives a timed filling period of 120/125 secs irrespective of CWST fill or mains fill, is this normal for this model?.

Both machines, if started with both filling valves shut will time out with a flashing run light after 5/6 minutes and I think the solenoid valves shut.

 

 

 

Can now confirm that a brand new ZWF7254B4PW behaves exactly as the ZWG6141P, ie both machines do a timed fill so fill level is dependent on water pressure so if one user has a mains pressure of 2 bar vs another with a pressure of 4 bar then the fill level will only be 71% and if supplied from a attic tank only 35%. of that at 4 bar pressure. Both these machines have exactly the same (analogue) level sensor where as my ZWF1221G has the contacts type level (pressure) switch.

[Whitegoodshelp (Andy)]

Hello John. That's interesting. I've never heard of any washing machine that controls water levels in any other way than detecting the actual level of water. That's what the pressure switch is for. I can't imagine any manufacturer would ever do a timed fill. I might be misunderstanding how you tested it but if you use two washing machines in the same house with the same water pressure they should take exactly the same amount of time to fill. 

If a washing machine fills for a set time some washing machines will end up with nowhere near enough water, not even enough water to cover the heating element which would cause the heating element to melt and distort and potentially even set laundry on fire. Others would have way too much water in. 

[john.G]

The 2006 machine (now passed on to a neighbour) had a actual pressure switch (331-06 7930025) to detect the fill level and will take ~ twice as long to fill when water supply changed from mains to attic header tank supply.

Both the 2013 and the new machine which have analogue switches (both 545-AA-017)  fill times increase by only a few seconds when supply changed from mains to attic header tank supply and the fill levels are clearly lower when on the lower pressure supply but are still visible above the inner drum bottom which means that the heating elements are covered?.

Would be interesting to see if other makers machines behave like mine.

[Whitegoodshelp (Andy)]

Hi John. The new style pressure switches do the same job as the mechanical ones but they just use a coil and magnet instead of spring-loaded switches. The old "analogue" pressure switches were either completely off - or completely on. But the new style switches are off, or on - and also various places in-between. So they can have sort of zones where if the water level is between say X level and Y level it can be acceptable.

[john.G]

I would agree that there is no technical reason why the pulse type level "switch" shouldn't give the same perfect fill levels as the older type pressure switch but here are my measured pumped out volumes with the 2013 machine and the new machine.

2013. (ZWG6141P).         Attic Supply: 5.9 Ltrs. Mains supply: 14.4 Ltrs.

New. (ZWF7254B4PW)   Attic Supply: 4.3 Ltrs. Mains supply:  13.8 Ltrs.

2006. (ZWF1221G).         Attic Supply: 16 Ltrs. Mains supply:  16 Ltrs.

I think the numbers speak for themselves.